"What is popular is not always right. What is right is not always popular." Francesco Totti.
By Cesar Diaz - NEW YORK, NY (Jun 4, 2012) US Soccer Players -- For the past few years, Major League Soccer commissioner Don Garber has openly signaled his intentions for a second New York club. He also said that in order for a second club to exist there must be a stadium plan. In addition, that stadium should be within the five boroughs.
Manhattan and Queens are the preferred candidates for a New York club that actually plays in New York. With the belief that a true NYC team would raise the League's profile along with revenue, MLS has dedicated staff and resources to find a stadium site and get a deal in place before bringing in an investor-operator. It's normally the other way around in MLS, stressing the importance of a New York team to the people running the League.
While this may appear possible, how realistic is it?
The league has repeatedly stated there are several ownerships interested in becoming the second New York MLS franchise. Considering the rumored $100 million ownership fee combined with a stadium plan, this new ownership will likely be required to invest considerably more just to get the team to the point of hiring a coach and putting together a squad.
All of this work happens in the shadow of the team 12 miles to the west in Harrison, New Jersey. The New York Red Bulls have a tough time playing to capacity at Red Bull Arena. Their public opinion is to welcome a NYC team since it would create a local derby and a higher level of interest. We already have a same-stadium example of that in MLS, and it doesn't equally distribute support. Even our LA example is telling, with the Los Angeles Galaxy also not a regular sellout.
Then there's the local sports history. The New York Jets wanted to relocate from North Jersey to Manhattan in a plan that would've put a National Football League stadium on the city's west side. Instead, they share a new stadium with the Giants next to where the old one once stood. The Jets were working with a plot of land on the river that's a rail yard. MLS's new point of interest is also on the west side, further south at Pier 40. Were the stadium plan to go through, it would be built on top of the pier.
As exciting as that sounds for fans of interesting stadium design, how realistic is this project? To get a better idea, I attended the Hudson River Park Trust Advisory Council Public Meeting last Thursday.
For those of you who are not familiar with the Hudson River Park Trust (HRPT), it’s a trust created in 1998 with the purpose of developing a five-mile park along the Hudson from Battery Park City to Hell’s Kitchen. Now in 2012, it’s only 70% complete. The cost of finishing the entire park area which includes Pier 54, Gansevoort, and Pier 97 is at an estimated $235 million. Just to be clear, the money is not expected to come from the rental facilities.
Even with all pitches, running/bike paths and other recreational activities such as boating, the Hudson River Park is financially strapped. One critical factor that was neglected when the trust was created was the future repairs and maintenance they would have to make over time.
For Pier 40 alone, the total cost of repair has been estimated to be in the ballpark figure of $120 - $125 millions. The money would go towards the eroding piers, the parking area and facility repairs such as the ceiling. On top of that, revenue from parking has been dropping steadily in recent years.
With about $25 million dollars in the HRPT reserve funds, there’s taking of amending the act in order to address the unanticipated expenses. Obviously, amending the act will impact the residents who live in the area.
As public hearings go, this one went as expected. A presentation was interrupted by several individuals who wanted to voice their displeasure against New York’s possible pipeline initiative, a different issue entirely. One of the presenters pointed out that Major League Soccer has stated it would pay to repair Pier 40, so it's worth considering what that adds to the tab of stadium construction. It was also reported that MLS has submitted a proposal that can't be considered under the current HRPT regulations. Thus the need for the amendment.
Following the presentation, the public had their say. Some are against amending the act while others argued for the sentimental value of Pier 40. Some suggested that the pier should be condemned, while one person made the case for asking New York University to move its campus to the pier site. Of course, there were people who continued to express their anger over fracking and pipelines.
What I found comical was the hissing some would make when others offered their opinions. For a group of people who obviously believe in the right of free speech and the democratic process, I was amazed by the little respect they showed while fellow citizens made their comments in two-minute blocks.
So what I did I learn from all this? Pier 40 has significant issues that would need considerable clout to overcome. Amending the HRPT act to make the stadium possible, repairing the site, and then building with a new owner in place are all significant hurdles, if not obstacles.
While the location of Pier 40 sounds nice, is it worth it? I don’t think so. The problem with repairs is that more repairs become uncovered. As a result, the costs of repairs and security will increase while the projected finish date gets revised. That assumes overcoming the regulatory issues in the first place. Right now, Pier 40 seems like an exercise in regulatory and civic frustration for any interested group, including a pro sports league trying to build a soccer stadium.
Cesar Diaz is a freelance writer for several online soccer publications. If there's a soccer topic you believe needs to be written about, please feel free to contact him. Easily approachable, you may contact him at CDiazNYC@gmail.com and @CesarDiazNYC.
More from Cesar Diaz:
I’ve been following this stuff as well. I’ve long thought a stadium in the five burroughs would be huge for the game. Of course, as you point out, that’s easier said than done. A couple of other interesting articles on the Pier 40 proposals:
link to thisisamericansoccer.com
link to totalfootblog.com
And this is why the Red Bulls play in Jersey.
Just offer to call it Sepp Blatter Stadium and send the renderings to Zurich. See how much money comes in from that…
MLS & NYC need a major league team in the city, but the west side is not the correct location. In spite of the planners and politicians seeming love of the west side sites, they would be traffic nightmares compared to other locations. And, you are correct they would be cost nightmares too as underwater issues were revealed. Further, a west side site is not convenient to the trains which could bring a large number of the potential fans from the immigrant neighborhoods as well as Long island and Westchester/Putnam. A site in Queens would grab the Long Island fans as well as those from the City and upstate. A Bronx site near one of the bridges would still get the Long Island fans as well as the upstate fans and city fans. Sites in either of those boro’s could easily be made accessible for much traffic and trains.
Let the Jets have Manhattan.
Meanwhile, isn’t the larger problem that there are competing factions trying to create this “new” team? None of them seem to have their act-together or is that a misconception?
Meanwhile, isn’t the larger problem that there are competing factions trying to create this “new” team? None of them seem to have their act-together or is that a misconception?
A little bit misconception. MLS said they have people in their office only focused on a stadium deal in New York. It’s a package they’ll design and attach an ownership to. There have been several groups connected with it, but the impression is MLS will streamline it considerably. This is different than the way they usually do expansion.
The problem with this is that it doesn’t allow for possible FUTURE small arena expansion, if there is to be an NYC 2 (Pier 40 being in in my opinion NYC 1). The idea seems to be to make a small neighborhood stadium on top of everything else money-wise which would be a hit in Manhattan. Drawing from the city , AND from Westchester, AND from Long Island is too generic, way too focused on any old footprint. It does nothing more than prevent future hyper-local opportunities. MLS is finally doing the right thing, they have finally embraced a small arena strategy, which is perfect for NYC. Everyone who complains about drawing from RBNY, or drawing from this neighborhood or that, is underestimating the probable demand for season tickets in NYC. There will be hundreds of thousands of applications for the 25000 available season tickets in Pier 40 if it happens. Patience people, every one will get their piece of the MLS pie. Picture an arena in Queens, AND Pier 40. Good for MLS, good for RBNY. Pier 40 is the right move, if they can make it work in Manhattan, other boroughs will be easier. We need to support this move, and tell the local elected officials we do.
I think you’re reading too much into MLS’s New York strategy. They aren’t building neighborhood teams and there’s no plan to turn New York into London in terms of multiple topflight clubs. That’s just not going to happen, in part because there would be competing small venues for everything that isn’t soccer. I also don’t think there will be season ticket sellouts anywhere in NYC. That doesn’t happen for the NBA and NHL teams that play on top of the train station. It doesn’t happen for the baseball teams. It’s not happening for MLS.
If you think there won’t be a season ticket wait list for a professional soccer franchise in wealthy and multi-international Manhattan, downtown, near Wall Street, on the water, you are (respectfully) out of your mind. This would immediately be a temple, win or lose. No fickle “we show up only when our team wins” like many other sports, on top of location and all other factors. The Rangers and the Knicks both currently have season ticket wait lists. The Green Bay Packers (more akin to the type of passion there would be for a small Manhattan MLS franchise) have a 75,000 person season ticket wait list. The Knicks routinely sell out their individual available tickets held for non season ticket holders in hours. And that’s even before talking about the luxury box wait list. Where are you getting your facts?
This pier 40 site for a soccer stadium is a crazy idea.I can’t believe the mls and the future owners of the cosmos would want to build at that site.They should concentrate on a few sites in Queens.Flushing meadows or sunnyside.Those two sites are much better they both have train service and a large amount of soccer fans.
Agreed. With all due respect to Patrick, this doesn’t seem to me to be a homerun waiting to happen. I don’t think anyone from the Wall St crowd is going to stay in the city to go see a summer night soccer game. They’re certainly not going to be entertaining clients there on a Saturday or Sunday. I also wonder what it’s going to look like on the weekends when it’s competing with the bridge and tunnel crowd heading into the city. If you’ve ever sat in traffic around the Holland Tunnel, you’re well aware of the problem.